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Post by Personnel Representative on Mar 22, 2012 11:34:16 GMT -5
Full draft debacle found here: mannhl.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=dougscorner&action=display&thread=10436&page=1Gist: - LA had 24 hours to pick or trade his 1st overall pick (until noon) - at 5am, a trade with Sharks was posted. The trade included a player with a NMC. - at 5:02am Sharks posts his pick if the trade with LA goes through - at 8am, Chicago, the next picker, posted his 2 options for when his turn came up - at 9am, Kings "drafts" MacKinnon - at noon, PR comes on and finds that the draft is being held up due to a NTC in his inbox. PR's Official StanceMy opinion? - this drafting scheme was complete bullshit. Here's why. 1) When Sharks "selected" MacKinnon, he did not have the right to do so - trade not finalized. 2) When LA "selected" MacKinnon, he did not have the right to do so, as the pick was in PENDING TRADES. Just as one is not allowed to scam out on a trade and trade someone to another team while there is a pending trade with another team, they thereby should not be allowed to DRAFT with a pick that is in a pending trade. 3) Since Chicago had a list in, and posted, and the trade is STILL stuck in pending as of this post, Chicago SHOULD get MacKinnon, and the draft should move forward.
More factors:- LA knew who Sharks wanted to pick, so drafting him then trading him would have saved us almost 20 hours of draft time. - As I said before, I am NOT responsible for when a guy waives, and I am NOT accepting the responsibility of holding up the draft to deal with such issues. Some Bullshit Game Changing FactorsI talked to Mikey and it seems he provided LA with some mediocre advice, in advising him to "just select MacKinnon", leading to several problems here. I am also informed that Sharks dd not know Parise had a NMC, and it was Pens who pointed this out to the traders. For the record, it is your responsibility to know who has a damned NMC and not to hold up the league's draft in the process. If Pens can find the NMC, YOU CAN TOO. The Final, Shitty VerdictMacKinnon is LAs right now. We will see what happens with the NMC request. I have not had time to look into it, and will do so when I can. Despite the fact that, for the most part, I made it, I strongly disagree with this verdict. But given all the "game changing" factors involved, and Leafs misguided advice, neither LA nor Sharks knowingly did anything wrong. Final Thought- Pens was right to be annoyed by this crap. Bullshit definitely took place. No cheating though. Just a large series of misunderstandings and miscommunications. That said, the LA-Pens bitch-fest in the draft thread was incredibly childish sounding for both parties. You both made yourselves look foolish. The FutureA rule will be posted soon that will basically prohibit the trading of players with NTCs from being traded when a team is "on the clock" for a pick. Possibly even make it so it has to be 1-2 turns before the pick in question is around. Further, as we've clarified here, you can NOT draft with a pick that is in a pending trade. Also, barely related, but also a result, a rule will be posted (if its not already) about "trade accepts" and post modifications. If a trade post is modified AFTER it has been accepted (based on time stamps) it MUST be re-accepted to avoid bullshit. To save this effort, if the other guy is not around, I would recommend posting any clarifications to your trade in the thread, rather than modifying the trade post. Post further questions, comments, debate here, in this thread. NOT the draft thread. |
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Post by Pittsburgh Penguins on Mar 22, 2012 11:50:04 GMT -5
Pardon me . No reply required
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Post by Boston Bruins on Mar 22, 2012 11:59:58 GMT -5
While this is definitely the way we should do the draft from picks 15-60 as we want those picks to go by as fast as possible, I think screwing LA/SJ out of the first selection would have been a mistake. I mean LA/SJ made their trade with multiple hours to spare.
While I know the next sentence is completely unreasonable as PR has a personal life and should not be expected to be online 24/7 dealing with us assholes, but the point is still valid: If PR had logged in a couple hours before the noon deadline instead of after then the trade would have been either accepted or rejected and then (depending who had the pick) LA's of SJ's auto-selection would have picked MacKinnon. (The EXACT same way CHI "auto-selected" MacKinnon and the other guy.)
I think the idea of giving CHI MacKinnon is dumb (no offense), I mean because of a NMC (that in the real NHL would have been resolved before the trade therefore not going past the deadline of the pick which if we are trying to be as realistic as possible in ManNHL is an important fact) and besides, PR logged on at noon so worse case we lose an hour to get the first overall pick right, big friggin deal.
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Post by Pittsburgh Penguins on Mar 22, 2012 12:04:36 GMT -5
Good Point. Teams should do like the real NHL and have had the player waive the NTC or NMC before they even offer them in a trade. Just like the Real NHL. But I am glad to know that we can bend rules, just as long as they don't break. It is fine line that I will enjoy with my picks aswell
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Post by Boston Bruins on Mar 22, 2012 12:10:46 GMT -5
Pens, I agree that this should be done as quickly as possible but no one broke the fucking rules when you went on your bitch-fest. There was still time when the trade was posted (and ignoring the fact LA & SJ thought there were no clauses and ignoring the other fact that LA & SJ thought they could set up a "auto-selection" the same damn way Chicago did to save time) and if PR had logged in at 11:30 and waived the player or right before posting the trade LA picked the guy SJ wanted you wouldn't be freaking out.
They did everything they were allowed to and to speed things along they both 'picked' MacKinnon. Everyone is freaking out over a fucking technicality, people need to relax and have fun for once.
I mean you didn't see me bitching about Anaheim winning the cup, they did it without Getzlaf, that was amazing, how the hell do I have the right to complain and be a baby about it? How do you?
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Post by Pittsburgh Penguins on Mar 22, 2012 12:13:31 GMT -5
Guess what? If I hadn't given them a heads up on, it would have been realized later and trade would have voided and screwed up alot oif shit. IT WAS A FUCKIN HEADS UP, that I keep getting attacked for. Fuck this is a joke.
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Post by Boston Bruins on Mar 22, 2012 12:21:11 GMT -5
no, you get attacked for being a child:
You just said this: "But I am glad to know that we can bend rules, just as long as they don't break. It is fine line that I will enjoy with my picks aswell "
That is being a baby.
Your also getting shit for your 3 page long bitch-fest in the draft section that started from 9:30am (no deadline passed yet) until now.
And if we never noticed the NMC no trade would have been over-turned (how do you over-turn something that you didn't notice) and SJ would have MacKinnon. If Parise had waived or rejected to waive before the deadline which is acceptable to believe he would have, SJ or LA would have MacKinnon, if we didn't make a big deal over the auto-selection SJ and LA teamed up to make, one of them would have MacKinnon. Your bitching over something that was resolved, about something that would not have slowed down the draft at all.
I thank you for being involved and being vigilant, but just relax a bit, it isn't the end of the world.
And I'll say it again, we did not lose any time in the draft, it is Edmonton's turn, in fact we are 24 hours ahead of schedule.
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Post by Pittsburgh Penguins on Mar 22, 2012 12:25:08 GMT -5
You guys are fucking clueless. They have overturned numerous trades on here weeks after they happened. Can't wait for my picks. I hope you pick after me a few times. It will alteast make alittle fun for me. But no worries. No more heads up on things, no more letting you guys know that 3 teams played year over the payroll. You guys find it on your own. I'm sure your past experiences you do a good job on your own, LOL
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Post by Toronto Maple Leafs on Mar 22, 2012 12:26:54 GMT -5
Pens did the right thing. Kings and sharks and myself unknowingly did the wrong thing but this is a situation in which everyone is right and there is no definitive correct answer. It's dealt with and we move on and I respect everyone's opinion on the matter.
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Post by mattyh on Mar 22, 2012 12:28:29 GMT -5
Pens did the right thing. Kings and sharks and myself unknowingly did the wrong thing but this is a situation in which everyone is right and there is no definitive correct answer. It's dealt with and we move on and I respect everyone's opinion on the matter. Agree, lets move the fuck on with it lol |
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Post by Pittsburgh Penguins on Mar 22, 2012 12:29:56 GMT -5
Yes, I have learned a valuable lesson. Letting people know what is going in unappreciated
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Post by Personnel Representative on Mar 22, 2012 12:31:24 GMT -5
It is fine line that I will enjoy with my picks aswell Why not just be the bigger man and continue to do things with dignity, instead of resorting to this childish nonsense? We established that Sharks and LA were fuck-ups, why join the club? |
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Post by Boston Bruins on Mar 22, 2012 12:32:49 GMT -5
You guys are fucking clueless. They have overturned numerous trades on here weeks after they happened. Can't wait for my picks. I hope you pick after me a few times. It will alteast make alittle fun for me. But no worries. No more heads up on things, no more letting you guys know that 3 teams played year over the payroll. You guys find it on your own. I'm sure your past experiences you do a good job on your own, LOL it is really rare to see a 44 year old acting like a 9 year old. "Screw you guys, I'm going home" mentality right? If you cannot take criticism or cannot have a grown up disagreement I'm perfectly fine with you taking your ball and going home. One or two of the 7 billion on this planet will disagree with you once and a while, get over it. Personally I hope you don't let this childish mind-set keep you from being active on this site, you do a great job which is most definitely thankless and I credit you for that but you have to be able to either let something go once in a while. I was only giving my 2 cents on the issue not attacking you, in fact, I didn't even mention you at all in my first post. Your the one who took this personally. |
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Post by Personnel Representative on Mar 22, 2012 12:34:07 GMT -5
If PR had logged in a couple hours before the noon deadline instead of after then the trade would have been either accepted or rejected and then (depending who had the pick) LA's of SJ's auto-selection would have picked MacKinnon. (The EXACT same way CHI "auto-selected" MacKinnon and the other guy.) The point is not that I am unwilling to log in, its that I am unwilling to accept the burden of holding up the draft, and having the other 28gms wait for me to sign in. If it only affected those involved, sure. But if someone is next, and online, they should not be forced to wait a possible 4-6 hours for me to sign in so they know who they can or can not pick. It's about the hold-up factor. It's not okay to me for people to have to wait longer than needed at all, weather thats because of me, or whatever. For that reason, I'm equally not okay with the first pick "taking an extra hour", because a hour can be the difference between the next guy picking now (if he is online) or in 23 hours (if he has to wait until he is next available). It is fine line that I will enjoy with my picks aswell Why not just be the bigger man and continue to do things with dignity, instead of resorting to this childish nonsense? We established that Sharks and LA were fuck-ups, why join the club? Yes, I have learned a valuable lesson. Letting people know what is going in unappreciated Are you fucking kidding me? I just spent 2-3 hours of MY time defending, expanding, and elaborating on your posts, and blatantly stating you are correct. Aside from 3-4 hours of my day, what the fuck more do you want? |
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Post by Boston Bruins on Mar 22, 2012 12:37:31 GMT -5
If PR had logged in a couple hours before the noon deadline instead of after then the trade would have been either accepted or rejected and then (depending who had the pick) LA's of SJ's auto-selection would have picked MacKinnon. (The EXACT same way CHI "auto-selected" MacKinnon and the other guy.) The point is not that I am unwilling to log in, its that I am unwilling to accept the burden of holding up the draft, and having the other 28gms wait for me to sign in. If it only affected those involved, sure. But if someone is next, and online, they should not be forced to wait a possible 4-6 hours for me to sign in so they know who they can or can not pick. It's about the hold-up factor. It's not okay to me for people to have to wait longer than needed at all, weather thats because of me, or whatever. For that reason, I'm equally not okay with the first pick "taking an extra hour", because a hour can be the difference between the next guy picking now (if he is online) or in 23 hours (if he has to wait until he is next available). I agree you you here although you could argue it isn't hard for the next guy in line to either post the 2 guys he wants if he thinks he wont be back online (like Chicago did) or wait the 2 hours if need be, it isn't like he does not have the option to post the guys he wants, I mean if he logged in to pick, he can make 2 can't he. Anyway that being said, I will agree to disagree on some facts in this issue and agree on the rest, lol. Like Leafs said, this has been resolved and no one got screwed over (whether it be by missing his pick or time wise). Sorry for incidentally creating another mess, although I know some of you guys enjoy the conflict, lol. ;D |
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Post by Pittsburgh Penguins on Mar 22, 2012 12:37:32 GMT -5
It makes it difficult when everyminute somebody has something else to say about it. They want to drag it on and on. It started with me letting them know and I got attcked for it. Sure it has gone on from there. But everytime time Mattyh wants end it, he will go out with another jab each and every time. That is fine, I will have fun with it aswell. For alittle while anyway.
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Post by Personnel Representative on Mar 22, 2012 12:40:13 GMT -5
But everytime time Mattyh wants end it, he will go out with another jab each and every time. If you leave the argument, he is left jabbing at farts in the wind, and it is he who looks like the moron. Not you. |
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Post by mattyh on Mar 22, 2012 12:40:16 GMT -5
I've stopped posting in this JM and you go and bring me right back into it. I said I was done and am moving on from it. Obviously you aren't lol
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Post by Pittsburgh Penguins on Mar 22, 2012 12:42:13 GMT -5
Yes, you always move on Matty LOL
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Post by Personnel Representative on Mar 22, 2012 12:42:54 GMT -5
although I know some of you guys enjoy the conflict, lol. ;D What the fuck is this supposed to mean? Are you trying to pick a fight with me, shit-goblin? |
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