Belfour

[Vancouver Canucks]

May 15, 2011 20:22:10 GMT -5 xx-Former Flyers-xx said:

is sedin 46 years old?

IT doesn't matter Sherlock we don't have a NHL/NHLPHA here so no one can demand an undoing of a contract if PR Accepts it

[xx-Former Flyers-xx]

You're missing the point that its completely unrealistic. He's 46 Years Old.

[XX - Former Hawks - XX]

May 15, 2011 20:16:18 GMT -5 Vancouver Canucks said:

in some sense this is like the Kovalchuk signing except 11 of you are siding with the "NHL" and six of us are siding with the NHLPA. I sorta get why the NHLPA sided with Kovalchuk now. But why would you guys vote against it ?you guys aren't spending a single penny on him. If belf wants to sign Belfour to this contract let him do it It's his choice. I'd get pretty ticked if I signed Daniel Sedin to a 8 year 6 M contract and you guys rejected it we don't have a NHL / NHLPHA system here so really this shouldn't be an issue belf wanted to sign him and did end of the story whats with the commotion

We're not voting against it because of the contract. We're voting against it because it's unrealistic. This type of signing would set precedence for future signings just like this one. Goalies especially would not make it past this age. Belfour is 46. We just want this league to be more realistic rather than have signings like these..

Geez and I said I wouldn't explain why I voted Yes...

[Personnel Representative]

And this whole "precedence" thing is also my problem, because apparently people did no understand that rare occurences and one-time deals like this don't mean that every fucking guy to have ever played hockey is not returning. So I got offers for Gretzky, Maurice Richard, etc. People are too dumb to be given the benefit of the doubt apparently and NEED the structure of overruling this contract. It's sad, but i think its what needs to happen. Less freedom for GMs, more structure for the league. .

[Vancouver Canucks]

May 15, 2011 20:27:35 GMT -5 xx-Former Flyers-xx said:

You're missing the point that its completely unrealistic. He's 46 Years Old.

I'm missing the point ? dude your not spending A PENNY OR A DIME ON IT. Let it be the last that we ever see again on the site you guys have no power to veto it even though there is a poll on this.If I'm florida i'd ignore this and do my own thing you guys have no say in what I do with this team Belf is a smart guy he obviously know's what he's doing and This poll thing is Unrealistic because we have no NHLPHA/NHL.

[Vancouver Canucks]

May 15, 2011 20:30:54 GMT -5 Personnel Representative said:

And this whole "precedence" thing is also my problem, because apparently people did no understand that rare occurences and one-time deals like this don't mean that every fucking guy to have ever played hockey is not returning. So I got offers for Gretzky, Maurice Richard, etc. People are too dumb to be given the benefit of the doubt apparently and NEED the structure of overruling this contract. It's sad, but i think its what needs to happen. Less freedom for GMs, more structure for the league. .

PR what you did was fine Certain GM's just aren't getting it. So there is no need to reduce the power of a GM

[Personnel Representative]

"Certain PMs" are the majority, and since I am tired of telling people over and over again "No, Gordie Howe won't sign on your fucking team", i have seriously lost faith in the ability of this league to distinguish the difference between an anomaly and a precedent.

[XX - Former Wings - XX]

May 15, 2011 20:20:15 GMT -5 Anaheim Ducks said:

Leave the signing the way it is. It screws over FLA long term. Lets just LEARN from it and move on.

Thats not the point. It screws up Florida, not the GM. So when FLA decides to quit, the next in line is stuck with this shitty signing, and will doom the day that made him such.

This really shouldnt continue.

Solution: PR Mods

- Help in justifying MAJOR signings, that are negotiated in a tight nit, CONFIDENTIAL, group.

Its so simple, its complicated.

[Florida Panthers]

May 15, 2011 20:37:54 GMT -5 Vancouver Canucks said:

I'm missing the point ? dude your not spending A PENNY OR A DIME ON IT. Let it be the last that we ever see again on the site you guys have no power to veto it even though there is a poll on this.If I'm florida i'd ignore this and do my own thing you guys have no say in what I do with this team Belf is a smart guy he obviously know's what he's doing and This poll thing is Unrealistic because we have no NHLPHA/NHL.

-This man knows what he's doing.

[Personnel Representative]

FLA is a respected GM from ManNHL 1 and several other sites we've done. He also writes with Mike on hockey sites. As per my understanding. So THAT is not an issue.

[Personnel Representative]

And if you guys want realism in your league, guess what. CLeaning up a former GMs mess is A BIG PART of being a GM. Its not all roses and Patrick Roys people.

[Vancouver Canucks]

May 15, 2011 20:46:55 GMT -5 Personnel Representative said:

"Certain PMs" are the majority, and since I am tired of telling people over and over again "No, Gordie Howe won't sign on your fucking team", i have seriously lost faith in the ability of this league to distinguish the difference between an anomaly and a precedent.

PR your the man in charge of the Contracts and Such and it's none of their business you should of made a poll that said should we allow more contracts like this. Yes you should listen to the Majority on certain cases. But undoing a Contract like this is a bad move it would mean any contract that the "majority" don't like can be overturned.

[Vancouver Canucks]

May 15, 2011 20:50:49 GMT -5 Personnel Representative said:

And if you guys want realism in your league, guess what. CLeaning up a former GMs mess is A BIG PART of being a GM. Its not all roses and Patrick Roys people.

so is this issue Resolved ?

[Florida Panthers]

May 15, 2011 20:49:27 GMT -5 Personnel Representative said:

FLA is a respected GM from ManNHL 1 and several other sites we've done. He also writes with Mike on hockey sites. As per my understanding. So THAT is not an issue.

-Awh, thanks.

But, in all seriousness, I know what I'm doing. Personally, I am stunned that so many people would go against me, because I am so strong in my convictions, a lot like PR himself. If I want Belfour, then shut up about it, because more than likely, I'll be here longer than 99% of you (besides PR and Mike), I'm not quitting. I do a lot for this league, I want belfour, as per every site I join. The contract is big, but I have lots of salary space, so give it up, leave me alone, and move on.

[Personnel Representative]

May 15, 2011 20:55:27 GMT -5 Vancouver Canucks said:

May 15, 2011 20:50:49 GMT -5 Personnel Representative said:

And if you guys want realism in your league, guess what. CLeaning up a former GMs mess is A BIG PART of being a GM. Its not all roses and Patrick Roys people.

so is this issue Resolved ?

We put it to a vote, right now we are waiting for the vote to be completed. 16 votes either way, or majority after a reasonable period of time.

In regards to more contracts like this, THAT would be the dangerous poll, cause then we are letting the league dictate what contracts can and cannot be signed. If this is overturned, perhaps a new contract can be worked out (Kovalchuk in real NHL). This seemed to have been the ONE contract that made everyone go ape shit, so by letting everyone vote out their opinions, everyone wins. If its shot dead,I get no more offers for Mike Bossy. If it survives, I have my 0.01% anomalie contract out of the way and can just "no" every Henri Richard offer. My biggest problem is, as I keep saying, that people can't see the difference. They thing THIS is unrealistic, and to counter, they offer me contracts for the players I have mentioned. As if a dead guys or 80 year old men is any more realistic.

Moral: we'll vote it out, then its resolved to the majority's contentment. A little less lee-way will be given to GMs now regardless, now that we know the level of "realistic" everyone wants, and that there is no ability to self-govern and identify boundaries, so we'll leave it at that. Keep voting people. Either way.

[Boston Bruins]

the problem people are having is where is the line? It's not like Scott Neidermayer who was gone for a season, its a goalie who has not played in 3 years (4 years since playing a full season). If this is allowed then at some point can we all offer for The Great One? And if we stop signing players who are retired after this one, then it kinda sucks for those who made a play for Gretzky or Sakic get refused but you get your guy.

That being said, personally I dont care, in fact, feel free to change my vote to No IF we stop allowing people to sign retired players. It isn't realistic, and I think we should be realistic at least for the first season.

[Vancouver Canucks]

May 15, 2011 21:08:58 GMT -5 Personnel Representative said:

My biggest problem is, as I keep saying, that people can't see the difference. They thing THIS is unrealistic, and to counter, they offer me contracts for the players I have mentioned. As if a dead guys or 80 year old men is any more realistic.

Exactly

[Personnel Representative]

May 15, 2011 21:14:13 GMT -5 Boston Bruins said:

the problem people are having is where is the line?

Exactly. I assumed people had enough hockey sense to know the difference between a goalie with recent international experience,and signing a deal to cap up a few meaningful milestones, and a guy who has been retired for a decade and has nothing to prove. I was wrong. I admit this.

[Toronto Maple Leafs]

Honestly. I think if a player retires in real life they should retire here. Unfortunately, as sim seasons usually take three months, everyone in the NHL right now would literally retire after about 5 real life years of this site running, and that just makes it retarded and boring.

The Belfour signing is fucking retarded. Let's all just admit that. Whether or not we want to reverse it, it was seriously fucking retarded, hands down. If you put it and Sean Avery in a room together, the signing would be the most retarded thing in the room and that is just amazing.

Bringing Belfour back for a year? Sure. Five years? What in the hell.

But it's not about the contract. We all know Belfour is going to play one year, maybe two tops, likely see little to no action (he'll hit his record and retire) just like Cujo in his final year with the Leafs.

This is about setting the bar, and as far as I'm concerned, I think myself and PR have done a LOT to accommodate everything everyone has demanded.

We brought back Jagr, he went to one of his realistic choices. The contract was crazy, but it's essentially a pre-determined set of extensions should he decide not to retire or play free agency again.

We reunited the Niedermayers for one last run IN Canada, ALMOST in their home town.

We brought back Radulov, which might happen, but the flake bailed on the league for cash, but guess what? Preds wanted him back, we thought it was fair.

Isles wanted to hang onto Nabokov similar to what's happening in real life, and similar to the Yashin-Senators situation over a decade ago. We're making it happen.

Some of you have interests in a few KHL players, guess what, they're likely coming over.

I've even gone out of my way to help a lot of you with freeing up cap. (Drury, Langkow, Boyes). I haven't necessarily won any of my trades, but I'm doing what I can to make everyone else happy - Rangers lose Drury's cap after they couldn't waive him, Buffalo dealt me Myers but I had to take on the salaries of Boyes and Hecht while he got a thousand picks. Hurricanes favorite player is Phaneuf, and if you look at the trade I made with him on that one, I more than lose.

This is another of those situations. Belfour (Panthers) really wanted his real life idol who still kind of plays, but had back problems. We're letting him have that goaltender as a backup, just like many of you got your former Leafs in Allison and Tucker and fucking Aki Berg back in here.

Colorado is close to getting Forsberg and we're debating on Naslund.

Players like Bure and Mogilny are not coming back because they literally had injuries that forced them out of the game.

Forsberg is likely coming back but his player will have a retarded injury-prone status. We all like to see the guy make one last attempt.

I think we've been more than fair, more than accommodating and yes sometimes the contracts will seem whacky - that always happens in every single sim legue, for fuck sakes look at the god damn Jeff Finger contract in real life. Hell, throw Komisarek in there.

The fact is, we know it wasn't realistic, but it also wasn't really that far-fetched either and in a summer where the free agency crop SUCKED it was fun to get a little bit of intrigue out there.

Now we're most likely going to rid ourselves of this Belfour contract, but he'll still likely be signing a deal to play here and if everyone can just accept that for one season their team will love playing the Panthers, we can all continue to enjoy the one thing ManNHL ALWAYS does above every other sim league:

WE MAKE IT ABOUT THE GMS

And after what we've done in two weeks, no one can argue that.

[Nashville Predators]

Holy crap, that was long.